Who are the denialists now?

9 Responses to Who are the denialists now?

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2. David Bailey says:

   17 March 2012 at 22:04

   “backlash from the whole scientific community when they realise that their trust has been abused”
   I don’t know – the amazing truth must be that a substantial part of the scientific community knows “Global Warming” is scam, and turns the other way. Think of the president of the Royal Society, Sir Paul Nurse, Nobel Laureate, who narrated a very deceptive Horizon program about “climate denial”. He simply had to know what he was doing.
3. TinyCO2 says:

   18 March 2012 at 09:56

   I think you’re being a little unfair to Gleick and at the same time underestimating what drives him and those like him. He’s a fanatic. He’s reached the point where he believes the end justifies the means. He must truly believe that Heartland is part of a great multi tentacled monster that wants to destroy the planet. Of course it’s a dumb theory because it never explains where the evil oil barons hope to live when they’ve roasted the World. Moreover when he’d actually got the hard proof that Heartland weren’t a huge, oil funded, Machiavellian organisation, he didn’t believe his own evidence. The memo is closer to his mental picture of Heartland but even that must have been a poor likeness of what he feels must be still hidden. The memo was supposedly only sent to a subset of the board members, suggesting a plot within a plot. He dehumanises sceptics and you mustn’t fall into the same trap as he does.
   No-one commits credibility suicide without some powerful drivers and greed doesn’t gel because he put his own neck on the line. Someone less idealistic would have got a student or a climate change disciple to do the deed. Actually I was gob smacked he admitted to identity fraud but not forgery. I’d have thought it would be the other way round. There are manipulators in the AGW movement but on performance, Gleick isn’t one of them. Now Mann…
   The fanatics can be more dangerous than the manipulators. They never admit the gig is up. They fight to the bitter end and do dangerous and unpredictable things. The manipulators will draw back and take more middle ground positions, pretending they were never that extreme but the fanatics can’t change, because their stand point is based on their moral identity. Within their conviction that CAGW is genuine they are swayed by the idea that they must prove their cause. What does that extend to? Name calling. Closed shop (peer review and jobs for the boys). Exaggeration. Advocacy. And where next? Falsifying results? Physical threats or worse?
   Fanatics are both attractors and detractors to their cause. They draw people in because of their strong convictions and idealistic fervour. They drive people away because it eventually becomes apparent to others that the enthusiasm isn’t a healthy one and fanatics can’t deal with conflicting arguments. Normal people instinctively expect contradictory evidence (few things are black and white) but fanatics accept no dissent. The current trend for every weather event (and even geological incidents) to be ascribed to AGW is a good example of fanatical behaviour that works against their cause. Even the most casual knowledge of climate history reveals significant weather events, many of which dwarf anything we’ve seen I the last 50 years. People know that they can’t ALL be due to AGW. To mitigate this, AGW proponents talk about frequency of events rising. They are confident that people don’t have a mental graph of hurricane events by year and that for most weather events there aren’t the statistics to even compile one. A simple test to see if the IPCC was attempting honesty, would be the inclusion of many graphs like the ACE chart with a conclusion – “examining records so far indicates no temperature/cyclonic energy link”. I’d even accept the proviso – “as records are very short, this does not preclude there being a longer term trend”.
   Unfortunately AGW has attracted a huge fanatical following in the science, politics and industry. Normal, sceptical people are nervous of rejecting AGW science because the fanatics are numerous and unpredictable. They are so numerous that it’s hard to denounce them as having a mental illness. It fits well within the mentality of the hard line evangelical types and it’s no accident that the different religions are flirting with AGW as a new avenue for SIN. It also has parallels with the communist movement and that took many decades to be curbed. Depressing, ain’t it?
4. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:19

   CHALLENGE TO ALL COMENTERS, TO FIND BETTER ANSWERS
   Temperature in the atmosphere is NOT same as in human body; when under the armpit is 1C warmer than normal = the WHOLE body is warmer by that much. Time for mature debate; for real proofs, it’s time for the secular Skeptics to get on the front foot.
   Q: do you know that: oxygen + nitrogen are 998999ppm in the troposphere, CO2 only 260-400ppm? Q: do you know that O+N expand /shrink INSTANTLY in change of temperature? Q: do you know that; where they expand upwards; on the edge of the troposphere is minus – 90⁰C? Q: why O+N expand more, when warmed by 5⁰C, than when warmed by 2⁰C? A: when warmed by 5⁰C, they need to go further up, to intercept more extra coldness, to equalize. Q: if O+N are cooled after 10minutes to previous temperature, why they don’t stay expanded another 5 minutes extra? A: not to intercept too much extra coldness, to prevent too much cooling. A2: they stay expanded precisely as long as they are warmer – not one second more or less – that’s how they regulate to be same warmth units overall in the troposphere, every hour of every year and millennia!
   Q: do you know that: if troposphere warms up by 2⁰C extra – troposphere expands up into the stratosphere by 1km, how much extra coldness is there to intercept? A: intercepts extra appropriate coldness to counteract the extra heat in 3,5 seconds > that extra coldness falls to the ground in minutes Q: if O+N are warmed extra for 30minutes, why they don’t shrink after 15minutes, or after one day? A: if O+N after cooled to previous temperature; stayed expanded for a whole day extra > they would have redirected enough extra coldness, to freeze all the tropical rivers / lakes.
   Q: can CO2 of 260-400ppm prevent oxygen + nitrogen (998999ppm) of expanding when they warm up? A: O+N when warmed extra – they expand through the walls of a hi-tensile hand-grenade. Q: do you believe in the laws of physics, or in IPCC and the Warmist cult? The laws of physics say: part of the troposphere can get colder than normal – only when other part gets warmer than normal. B] if the WHOLE troposphere gets colder -> air shrinks -> intercepts less coldness on the edge of the troposphere > retains more heat and equalizes in a jiffy. C] both hemispheres cannot get warmer simultaneously for more than few minutes – if they doo -> troposphere expands extra -> intercepts extra coldness and equalizes in a jiffy. Q: do the O+N wait to warm up by 2-3⁰C, before they start expanding; or expand instantly extra when they warm up by 0,000001⁰C? Mitich formula: EH>AE>EHR (Extra Heat >Atmosphere Expands >Extra Heat Releases) Tons of extra CORRECT proofs, why I am a GLOBAL warming Infidel. I believe in climatic changes; big and small – I know that human can improve the climate / because water controls climate = to a degree, human can control water. On the other hand, the phony GLOBAL warmings are, yes, phony.
   Lots of B/S makes fertile imaginations. Money corrupts even honest people, lying is bread and butter to people involved in climatology, don’t blame them. Present our own ‘’honest’’ proofs. Warmist believe in 90% possibility of GLOBAL warming – the face Skeptics believe 101% in global warming
5. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:23

   OPEN CHALLENGE No.2, TO ALL COMENTERS; TO FIND MISTAKE, OR BETTER ANSWERS
   If any of the active Warmist / Skeptic gets outside the ‘’big city island heat’’: you can see 10km radios +10km up = 700km3 of air. There are horizontal and vertical winds. From those rocks over there, vertical wind goes up – behind there, vertical winds go in direction down towards the swamp – on the other side – vertical winds go fast up from that red, exposed soil to the sunlight – further there vertical wind goes in direction down towards the rice paddies – behind you, the wind goes upward from the farmer’s house walls / roof. Those winds slow when the cloud comes above… but depends on the angle the cloud approaches and its density / altitude… then those winds speed up again, but not at the same speed… red soil is warmed faster than the rocky outcrops. 2h after sundown, from the sandy soil and that house, vertical winds change directions. From the red soil and the rice paddy / swamp, change direction after midnight; but at slower speed.
   2]Those vertical winds are attacked by horizontal winds that are on different altitudes / directions every 90m. up. Sometime SOME winds travel at 3knots – others at 27knots – others at 40knots and rearrange the temperature constantly – then some slow down – on other altitude speed up. Who is recording the DIFERENT temperatures on every few cubic meters that is changing every 10 minutes in the year; in the space you can see?!?! The space you can see with your eyes, without moving, is area of 600 000 different temperatures, and those temperatures change every 10 minutes. There are 6000 thermometers monitoring for IPCC, on the WHOLE planet!
   They have only 1% of thermometers for what is needed, to monitor the space you can see with your eyes. How many thermometers you think you will see in those 700km3?! How much larger area on the planet you cannot see without mowing?!? Be honest to yourself. Not 100-200-300-6000 years ago… NOW they have 6 000 thermometers for the WHOLE planet, that is sending them data; mostly on the ground / most concentrated in Europe /USA…
   It’s same as monitoring the amount of water in 6 creeks in your area; if this year those 6 creeks have 25% more water – to declare that: the WHOLE planet has 25% more water. Would you believe that? if not, why do you believe that they know if the WHOLE planet is warmer, with precision, by 0,135C? Which means: if is warmer where they are monitoring – it’s colder some place where nobody is monitoring. Not necessary by 0,235C; if your creek behind your house has 25% more water this year – doesn’t mean that Amazon river has 25% less water. Same as; if Europe is warmer by 0,75C, Oceania needs to get cooler by only 0,023C, because is much larger area than Europe. It proves that: in the 70’s wasn’t colder planet, in 90’s wasn’t warmer planet, is not cooling again (missing heat). It means that they are lying EVERY time!!! But the Skeptic zombies are looking for sunspots, galactic dust and other crap; to create backdoor exit for the extreme Warmist. Fundamentalist Skeptics are doing the Warmist dirty job = Hansen, Mann, Al Gore must be saving themselves millions, on toilet paper; because they don’t want to admit that they have being duped by Plimer and Lord Monkton!!! The ”fake Skeptics” deserve a medal from Al Gore, Hansen
   Extra heat in the atmosphere is not accumulative – because of INSTANT expansion / shrinking of oxygen + nitrogen in change of temperature!!! For the last 150y, the planet hasn’t accumulated enough extra heat, to boil one chicken egg. Look at their GLOBAL temperature charts… those charts don’t tell about the GLOBAL temperature, but is the ‘’smoking gun’’ admission that they are the biggest shameless liars. Time to get on the front foot and expose the Warmist conspiracy, and the fundamentalist Sceptic’s ignorance / stupidity. Same laws of physics were 5BC, 1230AD, 1850AD, 1998AD, 2011AD, and it will be the SAME LAWS OF PHYSICS in 2100 !!! O+N will be expanding / shrinking in change of temp, just the same as today. If you use the laws of physics, is same as travelling in time. Unfortunately, if you take the Fundamentalist Warmist and fake Skeptics in time machine to 2100 – they see that is same temp as today – then bring them back – they will still promote GLOBAL warming for 2100. About 80% of the people on the street are secular Warmist / Skeptics – interested in the truth. Ignore fanatics from both camps in the blogosphere, help me inform the truth, to the people on the street = you will be doing noble job. The truth always wins on the end.
   Nobody knows the temperature in the troposphere for last year, to save his life; but the fake Skeptics / extreme Warmist pretend to know for year 1700, 1200AD, 5BC for the WHOLE planet. They know which year was warmer by 0,012⁰C, or colder than the previous year… look at their charts… What was the temperature 345km NE of Wellington? People didn’t even know that New Zealand existed at that time… What about 432km SW of Hobart, at 357m altitude on the year after, on 4 of July at 9,35AM; or 456km SW of Easter island on that same time of the day at 69m altitude? Is Easter island not on their globe? Easter island in Pacific represents 20 times larger atmosphere than Europe + USA. Was it cloudy on that day? When gets cloudy – upper atmosphere gets warmer – on the ground cooler; but that rule is only for daytime; at night is opposite; but not if it wasn’t cloudy… depends on the thickness AND altitude of the cloud, also if it was cloudy all day; or as usual, clouds accumulate by the evening. Com-on ‘’leading scientist with temperature charts’’. Temperature in the troposphere is 3 dimensional. Would you buy a used car from a GLOBAL temperature chart maker?! Because of them, billions of $$$ are getting ripped-off, because of them, tremendous damages are getting done to the economy, environment and to kid’s brains in school and university. People shouldn’t profit from crime; existing law says.
   With that lousy accuracy, when they state that: one year was warmer or colder than the next by 0,025⁰C, it’s only admission that he / she is honesty deficient! For correct data, must be from every cubic meter of air, equally; for every 10 minutes in the year; from the ground to the edge of the troposphere. Not only from the hottest minute in the day – unless the hottest minute is on same time, every day on every place on the planet; and ALL other minutes go up every day as much as the hottest minute. Otherwise it’s all bull. When some place is warmer than usual – declaring the WHOLE planet is warmer – is same as saying: the planet is warmer at lunch time by 12⁰C, than before sunrise…?! That’s how reliable their data collection is. They collect data on 6 000 places on the planet / not evenly distributed. It’s ESSENTIAL to have from 6 000 trillion places data to be collected, for every few minutes, before can start talking about reliability of GLOBAL temperature. They are not interested in correct data; because correct data is proving them wrong. Local temperatures always fluctuate, (otherwise the winds would stop) – GLOBAL, never! That makes the ”Fake Skeptics” more guilty than the Swindlers
   Do you know why the hottest minute of the day is not on same minute, not even in same hour every day?! B] Why different places have different minutes as the hottest minute of the day? Therefore, collecting temperature for the hottest minute in the day is completely meaningless! B] If one day has one hour above 20⁰C, but the following day has 3h-4h above 20⁰C, is much more impotent than picking the hottest minute. 2] average temperature for every minute in 24h and the hottest minute don’t fluctuate the same == it’s only useful for the B/S Merchants. 3] if vertical wind with extra coldness was only 55m on the way down; when the temperature for that day was recorded for that place, but not tomorrow, or not on the other side of the hill…?
6. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:26

   Extra heat in the atmosphere is not accumulative – because of the expansion and shrinking of oxygen + nitrogen in change of temperature > if you collect all the extra heat accumulated in the atmosphere for the last 150years – you wouldn’t have enough heat, to boil one chicken egg!!! I suggested in my book: ‘’all charts about global temperatures, should be printed on soft paper only, to have some positive use. That’s all what the fuss is about?! Stefan‘s formula: EC > AS > LHR (Extra Coldness -> Atmosphere Shrinks -> Less Heat Releases) References about colder years / mini ice age, LIA, the big one; they were ALL localised. For the duration of the Big Ice Age, in Europe / USA (N/H), on the southern hemisphere was much, much warmer than normal. Don’t forget the laws of physics; same laws of physics were then, as today!!! If the whole troposphere get colder; oxygen + nitrogen shrink, INSTANTLY! Which means, release less heat / intercept less coldness, if you will; and equalises in a jiffy. Let me tell you something that everybody overlooks: tomorrow the planet will be exactly as warm as yesterday – today the sun will produce tremendous amount of heat on our planet; but ALL will be wasted, all of it + all the geothermal heat released into the air, precisely, all of it gone. All the heat from burning fuel; all gone
   But presume that the whole troposphere got much colder for some reason – troposphere instantly shrinks and WASTES only half of the heat that the sun produces on earth for 5 minutes – do you know how much extra heat would stay / save / accumulate in 5 minutes?! Would finish the biggest ice age in 5 minutes! My formula is the best proof: EC > AS > LHR (Extra Coldness > Atmosphere Shrinks > Less Heat Releases) Similar as when you are cold in bad – you go in foetus position – to minimize surface exposure – when you get warm, you spread arms and legs for bigger cooling exposure. In other words, you are doing a lousy imitation of what the troposphere can do. You minimise / maximise of 5% of extra surface area; troposphere can shrink / double in volume INSTANTLY, if necessary!!! Q: how fast can oxygen and nitrogen expand when warmed up? A: by expanding, they are pushing the bullet with high velocity from the barrel of the gun, no delay for a decade.
   The only way one hemisphere can get colder / ice age, is: if the other hemisphere simultaneously gets WARMER by as much, to equalise! Because in that case, on the hemisphere that gets colder – the air shrinks / volume decreases – but the EXTRA volume of air from the opposite hemisphere because of extra warming, is compensating in volume; for shrinking on the colder half – or in the Ice Age, then was 30- 40% of the planet’s area colder. The shonky scientists in the last 150 years were COMPLETELY disregarding the laws of physics!!!… As a bi-product, we had Nuclear Winter for year 2000 / lots of PHONY GLOBAL warmings predicted in the past (from the ”pretend Skeptics) and in 100 years a PHONY GLOBAL warming, by the Conspirators. Yes, in the past Organised Crime was robbing banks and shops; now with CO2 / Methane conspiracy /con, they are robbing nations / countries… They are robbing the poor, the pensioner, the low paid; because carbon tax is a flat-rate tax. On every product in the shop, the pensioner pays same carbon-tax as the millionaire. The loot money disappears in the jet-setters pockets + for unnecessary phony GLOBAL warmings ‘’researchers / conferences. The ‘’spoils’’ are not evenly divided; the biggest liars get the most. The ‘’Believers’’ of the lower genera and IQ, as usual, get the middle finger on the end; they are the collateral damage. The fake Skeptics are getting the middle finger all the time; they are the born losers.
   Q: do you think that: during the medieval PHONY GLOBAL warming; the laws of physics were different than today?
   Q: do you believe that 15000BC or in a 100 years from today, the SAME laws of physics didn’t and will not exist?
7. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:28

   Which brings back to collecting the data from the hottest minute of the day; which is not on same minute / not even on same hour every day!!! What about the other 1439 minutes in 24h, fellas??? When nights are warmer than usual, as in Brazil, there is reason for it. When days are warmer than should be on a particular latitude, as in Sahara, there is reason for it (H2O)!!! The shonky ‘’climatologist’’ don’t want you to know about those reasons – because they declared water vapour as a bad gas, to support badmouthing CO2 (because their effect is same, only is more H2O than CO2).
   That SAME affect means: H2O + CO2 make cooler days and warmer nights, on the ground – absence of those gases, especially H2O, as in Sahara, HOTTER DAYS / COLDER NIGHTS= worse climate. If you don’t know which is better climate, Sahara or Brazil; ask the trees. Trees don’t have woollen cloths and air-conditioners like you. Warmist hypocrisy exposed!!! In Sahara the ‘’vertical winds’’ are much STRONGER than in Brazil. As a result, in Sahara cools down from 45C to 5C at night, in 12h. In that same 12h, on same distance from the equator and the polls, in Brazil cools from 33C day time, to 23C at night, in 12h. Which means: in Sahara, the ‘’faster vertical winds’’ cool by 30C more in 12h, than in Brazil, where those winds are much slower. THOSE VERTICAL WINDS CAN INSTANTLY SPEED UP ON THE WHOLE PLANET, IF IT GETS WARMER!!! If those vertical winds can cool by 30C more in 12h, is an INSULT TO HUMAN INTELEGENCE, the Warmist lie that the planet will get warmer every 10years by 0,5C. It wouldn’t make sense to an earth worm, but it does make sense to prof Ian Plimer’s Smarties… (the fake Skeptics) The logic and common sense deficient D/H.
   Q: why those basic factors are not used by the Conspirators and their B/S distributors?
   Q: why those basic factors are not noticed / when I state; are avoided by the ‘’fake Skeptics +Warmist?
8. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:30

   In the military book says: if you see a flashlight from atom bomb explosion in the distance – instantly hit the ground, with your butt towards ground zero and put the gasmask on – then 3 minutes after the original blast, if you can turn your head towards ground zero. Because after three (3) minutes – the wind with same speed as the explosion, goes BACK towards the ground zero and demolishes just as much, already weakened concrete buildings. But, turning in the opposite direction without getting up – otherwise – the returning wind will take you to ground zero.
   What the issue here is: atom bomb is heating oxygen + nitrogen to millions of degrees – they expand and their SPEED damages concrete buildings; not the 20-30kg of plutonium – (reason atom bomb is useless out of space, where is no oxygen + nitrogen) effect would be as few shotgun pellets (apart in Hollywood entertainment). O+N wouldn’t have SHRUNK after three (3) minutes – IF THEY WERE NOT COOLED –that’s the issue!!! But, they shrink almost as fast as they expand from the explosion. They shrink with the speed of the bullet and demolish the already weakened concrete buildings. MILLION DEGREES, O+N COOL IN THREE (3) MINUTES – the shonky ‘’experts’’ tell you that: in 10 years, the planet will be warmer by 0,156C… Cannot cool fraction of a degree, in 10 years ?! Thanks to the fake Skeptics…
   No, when air close to the ground warms up EXTRA, by 1-2-3C, doesn’t expand as fast as by atom bomb; but expands accordingly, by the amount of extra heat / INSTANTLY. Just that atom bomb is taking dust + WATER VAPOUR + CO2 – it gives better chance to be analysed visually; what normal extra warming does to oxygen + nitrogen. I.e. if is localized extra warming – that part of the troposphere expands into the stratosphere as a nuclear mushroom – then intercepts appropriate amount of extra coldness in 3,5 seconds – then INSTANTLY shrinks and brings that extra coldness to the ground in a jiffy.
9. stefanthedenier says:

   30 March 2012 at 03:40

   Another one: Greenland and Antarctic are almost as large as USA. On Greenland, and Antarctic are few thermometers clustered on a very small area. B] if the weather bureau was reporting the temperature for few places in Florida – as the temperature for the WHOLE of USA, many people wouldn’t believe that is same. In the evening when they report the weather for the whole of USA; remember what Stefan was saying: compare yourself if: when the temperature in Florida goes up by one, or two degrees for next day, does the temperature in all of the states goes up by EXACTLY that much. Or, some places goes up, some down. Some place by more some by less. Therefore: not having data collected on every kilometre on Antarctic / Greenland = is blatant misleading. Then see on how many places the temperature is monitored in central Pacific for IPCC? Central Pacific is 15 times larger than USA. On how many other places is not monitored? If in between two monitoring places is a different temperature that doesn’t fit to one of them… all that area is OVERLOOKED. That is for temperature on the ground. Unwritten rule is: when close to the ground is cooler than normal > upper atmosphere is warmer than normal. Q: upper atmosphere is 90% of the troposphere… occasionally they send a balloon… to monitor on 1m3…??? Satellite takes occasional TWO DIMENSIONAL infrared photo…?! KING Al IS NAKED!!! The ‘’fake Skeptics’’ are Al’s fig leafs.
   Q: can the Warmist realize that: heat distribution on the earth is 3 dimensional? A: of course they can, but is against their theology. Q: can the fake Skeptics realize the truth? A: only if is a secular Skeptic. ‘’Closed parashoth brains’’ don’t function.

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